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	<title>Comments on: Reverse-Engineering From Stories</title>
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	<pubDate>Sun, 22 Nov 2009 12:29:50 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Haeresis</title>
		<link>http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/07/02/reverse-engineering-from-stories/comment-page-1/#comment-2398</link>
		<dc:creator>Haeresis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Jul 2005 05:38:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/07/02/reverse-engineering-from-stories/#comment-2398</guid>
		<description>Consider Aquinas and his quest for meaning, creating hierarchies of symbolism, only to transcend them all and abandon the project never to return.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Consider Aquinas and his quest for meaning, creating hierarchies of symbolism, only to transcend them all and abandon the project never to return.</p>
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		<title>By: Haeresis</title>
		<link>http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/07/02/reverse-engineering-from-stories/comment-page-1/#comment-2397</link>
		<dc:creator>Haeresis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Jul 2005 05:36:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/07/02/reverse-engineering-from-stories/#comment-2397</guid>
		<description>In fact, in a sense, the occult seems to be entirely devoted to the â€œendless shells of interpretationâ€ - or at least on the surface.---

In a sense, yes...but you're not really moving outward.  In magick, the systems of symbolism are minutely explored, compared, and turned inside out..eventually, all those seemingly disparate things begin to blend together into an experience of unity.  (example- the serpent on the cross &#38; the gematric relationship between the serpent and the messiah, two outwardly irrewconcilable symbols)

In a (kabbalistic) sense you're going back up the tree, reconciling the "shells."  in a way, you're putting the pattern-recognition part of your brain on overdrive.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In fact, in a sense, the occult seems to be entirely devoted to the â€œendless shells of interpretationâ€ - or at least on the surface.&#8212;</p>
<p>In a sense, yes&#8230;but you&#8217;re not really moving outward.  In magick, the systems of symbolism are minutely explored, compared, and turned inside out..eventually, all those seemingly disparate things begin to blend together into an experience of unity.  (example- the serpent on the cross &amp; the gematric relationship between the serpent and the messiah, two outwardly irrewconcilable symbols)</p>
<p>In a (kabbalistic) sense you&#8217;re going back up the tree, reconciling the &#8220;shells.&#8221;  in a way, you&#8217;re putting the pattern-recognition part of your brain on overdrive.</p>
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		<title>By: Occult Investigator  &#187; Endless Shells</title>
		<link>http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/07/02/reverse-engineering-from-stories/comment-page-1/#comment-2363</link>
		<dc:creator>Occult Investigator  &#187; Endless Shells</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Jul 2005 22:12:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/07/02/reverse-engineering-from-stories/#comment-2363</guid>
		<description>[...] my FAQ page!    				   	 		 	 		 			Endless Shells 	 			 					Z. left a really good comment on my article about reverse-engineering  [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] my FAQ page!</p>
<p> 			Endless Shells</p>
<p> 					Z. left a really good comment on my article about reverse-engineering  [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Occult Investigator  &#187; Intentional Burnout</title>
		<link>http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/07/02/reverse-engineering-from-stories/comment-page-1/#comment-2342</link>
		<dc:creator>Occult Investigator  &#187; Intentional Burnout</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Jul 2005 17:06:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/07/02/reverse-engineering-from-stories/#comment-2342</guid>
		<description>[...] ntentional Burnout 	 			 					Eric left an excellent comment on my article about &#8220;reverse-engineering&#8220;: 	I cooked my brain doing this kind of  [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] ntentional Burnout</p>
<p> 					Eric left an excellent comment on my article about &#8220;reverse-engineering&#8220;: 	I cooked my brain doing this kind of  [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Occult Investigator</title>
		<link>http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/07/02/reverse-engineering-from-stories/comment-page-1/#comment-2331</link>
		<dc:creator>Occult Investigator</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Jul 2005 16:20:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/07/02/reverse-engineering-from-stories/#comment-2331</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;I cooked my brain doing this kind of thinking a few months ago, and got totally burned out on everything.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I guess that's what I'm actually &lt;em&gt;trying&lt;/em&gt; to do. Weird as that may sound...

&lt;blockquote&gt;getting caught up in â€œreasonâ€, which always contains within itself the germ of its own self destruction.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

And that's the method to my madness at the moment, to use reason against itself, and try to dismantle it from the inside. 

Anyway Z, I see what you're saying and wrote exactly the same thoughts on Crowley's "True Will" in a previous post. However, I don't so much see the connection between that and the quote you posted from him...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>I cooked my brain doing this kind of thinking a few months ago, and got totally burned out on everything.</p></blockquote>
<p>I guess that&#8217;s what I&#8217;m actually <em>trying</em> to do. Weird as that may sound&#8230;</p>
<blockquote><p>getting caught up in â€œreasonâ€, which always contains within itself the germ of its own self destruction.</p></blockquote>
<p>And that&#8217;s the method to my madness at the moment, to use reason against itself, and try to dismantle it from the inside. </p>
<p>Anyway Z, I see what you&#8217;re saying and wrote exactly the same thoughts on Crowley&#8217;s &#8220;True Will&#8221; in a previous post. However, I don&#8217;t so much see the connection between that and the quote you posted from him&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Gina</title>
		<link>http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/07/02/reverse-engineering-from-stories/comment-page-1/#comment-2319</link>
		<dc:creator>Gina</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Jul 2005 13:27:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/07/02/reverse-engineering-from-stories/#comment-2319</guid>
		<description>
 Isn't the childlike state of mind simply unawareness of cultural duality? Isnt that the state one tries to recapture in enlightenment and gnosis, the non-duality of the universe  and throwing off of these "shells of interpretation"? Aren't they (children) closer to the source, since they have not yet embraced these interpretations, hence the saying through the eyes of a child? Blessed are the children?

How does one live in a state of constant acceptance of  duality that surrounds them especially in the occult and organised religion without being swept up in it's duality and judgement,  I think its almost impossible unless one becomes a recluse, or as a child or unless we empty ourselves of thought routinely, even if its only for a few minutes a day, which relates back to your ideas on absolute bodhicitta. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Isn&#8217;t the childlike state of mind simply unawareness of cultural duality? Isnt that the state one tries to recapture in enlightenment and gnosis, the non-duality of the universe  and throwing off of these &#8220;shells of interpretation&#8221;? Aren&#8217;t they (children) closer to the source, since they have not yet embraced these interpretations, hence the saying through the eyes of a child? Blessed are the children?</p>
<p>How does one live in a state of constant acceptance of  duality that surrounds them especially in the occult and organised religion without being swept up in it&#8217;s duality and judgement,  I think its almost impossible unless one becomes a recluse, or as a child or unless we empty ourselves of thought routinely, even if its only for a few minutes a day, which relates back to your ideas on absolute bodhicitta.</p>
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		<title>By: Z.</title>
		<link>http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/07/02/reverse-engineering-from-stories/comment-page-1/#comment-2318</link>
		<dc:creator>Z.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Jul 2005 10:16:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/07/02/reverse-engineering-from-stories/#comment-2318</guid>
		<description>&lt;em&gt;In fact, in a sense, the occult seems to be entirely devoted to the â€œendless shells of interpretationâ€ - or at least on the surface.&lt;/em&gt;

Well ... I'd disagree. Of course, it &lt;em&gt;might&lt;/em&gt; appear that way if all one does is listen to or read endless debates on or about occultism in general, but occultism - or at least magick - is centered around actually &lt;em&gt;doing&lt;/em&gt; things, instead of getting caught up in "reason", which always contains within itself the germ of its own self destruction.

As Aleister Crowley wrote in his &lt;a href="http://www.hermetic.com/crowley/libers/libero.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;Liber O&lt;/a&gt;:

&lt;blockquote&gt;In this book it is spoken of the Sephiroth and the Paths; of Spirits and Conjurations; of Gods, Spheres, Planes, and many other things which may or may not exist.

It is immaterial whether these exist or not. By doing certain things certain results will follow; students are most earnestly warned against attributing objective reality or philosophic validity to any of them.&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>In fact, in a sense, the occult seems to be entirely devoted to the â€œendless shells of interpretationâ€ - or at least on the surface.</em></p>
<p>Well &#8230; I&#8217;d disagree. Of course, it <em>might</em> appear that way if all one does is listen to or read endless debates on or about occultism in general, but occultism - or at least magick - is centered around actually <em>doing</em> things, instead of getting caught up in &#8220;reason&#8221;, which always contains within itself the germ of its own self destruction.</p>
<p>As Aleister Crowley wrote in his <a href="http://www.hermetic.com/crowley/libers/libero.html" rel="nofollow">Liber O</a>:</p>
<blockquote><p>In this book it is spoken of the Sephiroth and the Paths; of Spirits and Conjurations; of Gods, Spheres, Planes, and many other things which may or may not exist.</p>
<p>It is immaterial whether these exist or not. By doing certain things certain results will follow; students are most earnestly warned against attributing objective reality or philosophic validity to any of them.</p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: Eric</title>
		<link>http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/07/02/reverse-engineering-from-stories/comment-page-1/#comment-2311</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Jul 2005 05:30:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/07/02/reverse-engineering-from-stories/#comment-2311</guid>
		<description>I cooked my brain doing this kind of thinking a few months ago, and got totally burned out on everything. I can't say if that'll happen to you, but if it does, I recommend you stop thinking and climb some trees.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I cooked my brain doing this kind of thinking a few months ago, and got totally burned out on everything. I can&#8217;t say if that&#8217;ll happen to you, but if it does, I recommend you stop thinking and climb some trees.</p>
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		<title>By: Occult Investigator  &#187; Reality as Meaning</title>
		<link>http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/07/02/reverse-engineering-from-stories/comment-page-1/#comment-2306</link>
		<dc:creator>Occult Investigator  &#187; Reality as Meaning</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Jul 2005 04:43:29 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>[...] oes this model then imply that the person who doesn&#8217;t recognize meaning is closer to &#8220;direct&#8221; child-like experience? How does this also fit [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] oes this model then imply that the person who doesn&#8217;t recognize meaning is closer to &#8220;direct&#8221; child-like experience? How does this also fit [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Dan</title>
		<link>http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/07/02/reverse-engineering-from-stories/comment-page-1/#comment-2301</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Jul 2005 04:12:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/07/02/reverse-engineering-from-stories/#comment-2301</guid>
		<description>I just wanted to say, Tim, that I totally get you -- I think. 

I simply cannot appreciate things today like I used to as a child. These days, expectations, value judgements, and interpretations of meaning separate me from directly experiencing anything anymore. Too many shells. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just wanted to say, Tim, that I totally get you &#8212; I think. </p>
<p>I simply cannot appreciate things today like I used to as a child. These days, expectations, value judgements, and interpretations of meaning separate me from directly experiencing anything anymore. Too many shells.</p>
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