Comments on: Do You Believe?

By: Kenneth W. Davis

Kenneth W. Davis — Wed, 12 Jul 2006 17:06:32 +0000

A great posting. It reminds me of the young reporter who was interviewing a back-woods old-timer. “Do you believe in baptism,” the reporter asked. “Believe, hell,” the older man replied. “I’ve seen it done!”

By: alistair

alistair — Wed, 12 Jul 2006 05:41:39 +0000

i guess all things lead back to robert anton wilson eventually. why would gnosicism be in conflict with african tribal practices? if they are both functional mechanisms for healing, insight and “getting” useful meta stuff, which i think they are at the core. anything which intuits the hypnosis of our existance can be used interelatedly with any other practice. it is only the dogmatist that will resist the use of other mechanisms. like mixing blues with jazz or tribal chants or cantatas. if done right nobody notices a thing…………….just music.

By: Rev Max

Rev Max — Tue, 11 Jul 2006 22:45:11 +0000

the belief stems from utility. that`s what i`ve always felt was the purpose of having beliefsâ€¦â€¦â€¦so they did stuff for us. tools.

———-

I wrote an email to Peter Carroll years ago asking him if he thought gnosticism was in conflict with african tribal religious practices. He replied something along the lines of “myths and beliefs are tools”

By: Jacob

Jacob — Tue, 11 Jul 2006 22:11:00 +0000

But I also donâ€™t believe that my belief is required for those things to be real. You can cast your vote for or against reality and it still exists.

I really liked this.

By: alistair

alistair — Tue, 11 Jul 2006 22:06:03 +0000

the belief stems from utility. that`s what i`ve always felt was the purpose of having beliefs………so they did stuff for us. tools.

By: Richard

Richard — Tue, 11 Jul 2006 20:09:47 +0000

I’ve often thought about the notion of whether I “believe in astrology.” To me it’s like asking “do I believe in English?” I recognize this might be a semantic game, but I see astrology first and foremost as a crafted language. It’s not a science, and I don’t impart a lot of religious value on astrology. It’s just fun! But I believe “in” astrology as a crafted language, much in the same way a lawyer believes in legalese or a doctor believes in. Or like myself, someone who lives in New York believes in (via the language as carrier of their content) English in the 12 Steps and 12 Traditions of AA because of their usefulness in my experience. I believe in poetry and tarot cards and playwriting all pretty much the same way. Food for thought.

By: alistair

alistair — Tue, 11 Jul 2006 20:04:36 +0000

what is it about tarot that people are asking you to believe in, the ability to see the future?
i have done readings for people using tarot and i find them to be a useful way for people to accept the dialog between us and eventually have a discussion about thier own values about things and eventually gain insight themselves as a result.
like sketchmonkey said.

By: pete

pete — Tue, 11 Jul 2006 18:21:03 +0000

So I’m assuming you’re in Baltimore now? How ya enjoying it? Trivial question for such an interesting update, to be sure, but I’m a traveller at heart….and I’ve always wanted to go there. Somewhere. Anywhere. It’s always exciting to find like-minded people in other parts of the world.

By: Tim Boucher

Tim Boucher — Tue, 11 Jul 2006 17:38:47 +0000

Very well put. I couldn’t have said it better myself.

By: sketchmonkey

sketchmonkey — Tue, 11 Jul 2006 16:33:01 +0000

I don’t think that it is necessary to ‘believe’ in Tarot to find value in its use. After all, a Tarot deck is comprised of archetypal imagery with various interpretations associated with said imagery. (The real question is how the hell did people come to understand, develop, & add an effective structure to such collections of imagery and interpretations?!?) Much like the I Ching, Tarot is not so much a thing that requires ‘belief’ in order to be effective… it is a tool for introspection… introspection itself being something which many people do not engage in or have much practice with. It is a matter of awareness & honesty with oneself. We are all expert liars to ourselves. Sometimes it takes a tool… and/ or someone else acting as a mediator… to shine light on those dark mysteries in us (often times obscured by us as a matter of convenience, laziness, coping, etc.) Thus the tool - be it I Ching or Tarot - acts much like a placebo drug that triggers the mind into action/ manifestion of intent. If you ‘intend’ to have an answer (insight, really) from the Tarot you will find one, much like one can see shapes in the clouds (although it must be caution that overreliance on divination is dangerous because you can get caught up in the imagery & lose site of meaning; in that way lies madness). It in no way diminishes the legitimacy or effectiveness of the tool. The ‘effect’ or divination or whatever is a product of the mind/ spirit and not some inherent feature of the deck or book or whatever. The only ‘hocus pocus’ that is involved is in coming to a more nuanced understanding of what reality ‘is’ & how we process ‘it’ & what are those mental/ spiritual/ physical means of manipulating/ accessing, refining, & ‘properly’ aligning our own inherent power…